From Phillyburbs.com: "It's hard to make everyone happy. We could if we played three-hour sets like Robert Smith (of the Cure) plays. But the difference is that Robert just stands there and sings and plays guitar. Dave gives everything he has and you can't do that and play for three hours. Dave is all over the stage. He puts everything out there until he's dead."
Update: And the DM setlists just get shorter and shorter. Started at 22 in Toronto, dropped to 21 in Montreal, 20 in Boston, and hit a new low of 18 in NJ tonight. Who says DM doesn't change their setlists? : P And back up to 21 at NYC 1.
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No other artist I know can write better music than robert. when your ears evolve or mature you will understand. oh btw any news on the (dark)side of 4.13?
ReplyDeleteI guess Robert JUST stands there, plays guitar and sings because he DOESN'T have to do anything else other than PLAY his GUITAR and sing, he doesn't have to scamper around like some half ass cheerleader.....
ReplyDelete*giggle*
ReplyDeleteAnd... uhh... what exactly do you do on stage Andy? ;-)
ReplyDeleteI think he presses a sequencer button in 4/4 time....press, press, tap, press.....
ReplyDeleteHey now...I wouldn't call that standing During FREAKSHOW ;)
ReplyDeleteRobert can please the crowed with lip lick and nose wrinkle. (YUM!)
I've never seen an artist put more heart into a show than him - no need for silly shenanigans and running about.
I agree with every post before and would like to add...
ReplyDeleteMode could never put on a show like THE CURE, ever.
Or I guess Robert's just 'standing around' when they play Radio City Music Hall.....Climbing the balconies and ignoring security, yeah what a boring performer!!!!
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ReplyDeleteI've seen Depeche Mode and Dave is not that active. Give me a break.
ReplyDeleteSounds to me like DM is just a little raw because people are unfavorably comparing their shows with the epic efforts put forth by the Cure, who routinely bust out 3+ hour shows, with or without silly stage antics. DM is a band which means the fans are first and foremost there for the music, not for Dave's freakshow.
ReplyDeleteAnd Dave always feels the need at the end of almost every line to add a "Whoo" or "Yeah", it really ruins the songs for me. At the show last friday I suggested to my friends we make it a drinking game,
ReplyDeletehave a sip for every whoo or yeah,
"Sing it" was worth 2 drinks.
No-one would play, they all said they'd be passed out after 3 songs max. Chill out Dave!
Now, now. Dave does what he does and it's his thing. Both are very different groups and have had a large influence on many new groups. The Cure, IMO, have always had a more lush sound, a sound combined with the lyrics that inspire thought, I don't expect Robert to run around like a madman during "Faith" that would be preposterous. DM, has some of that but primarily concentrates on a dancier feel. The front man for a group like that kind of has to be a cheerleader. PLus for the other members, especially when Martin played more keys than guitar, you can't really move about behind a keyboard. Porl and Simon are able to bounce around with guitars in hand. They kind of have a "front man" feel to what they do as well. Fletch is not the front man nor does he even stand at the front of the stage so it's more forgiveable if he just stands there. He's a programmer, something an electronic band needs.
ReplyDeleteTrust me, if what you do is sing and play guitar, and you do it well, and write great songs, you don't need to be a "front man" so to speak. Plus on the songs where RS doesn't play guitar, he moves around. Maybe he doesn't shake his ass but he moves and it is entertaining none the less.
The sequences that the Cure are using are more filler, not the important part of the song. There are no sequenced/pre-recorded guitar parts like in Policy of Truth. I still love Violator, one of my all time favorite records of all time, but DM for me will always be more of a studio group. There is a fine line between what DM does and an overproduced karaoke act, but they pull it of because they are Depeche Mode.
"Yeah" "Whoo" "Alright"
ReplyDeleteI hate when he does that and I'm not looking forward to it at the show.
Still, Martin Gore's lyrics rank up there (to me) with Robert and Bernard Sumner.
He makes it sound like all Robert does is stand there on a blue dot staring downwards at a podium reading lyrics from a lectern. Not so fast, my friend!
ReplyDeleteRobert does spoil us Cure fans and love him for it!
Just for old time's sake I would love to see the boys do their "Why Can't I Be You?" routine..
ReplyDeleteYou'd have to agree it would be worth the price of admission!
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ReplyDeletelet's all join Fletch in his inevitable rounds of *clap* LOL....
ReplyDeletetwo totally different experiences for sure... and both appreciated differently... sure I wish DM would play longer and change up the setlists more- but I'm ok with that....the Cure just spoils us is all :).
had to delete and repost- bad spelling..
Yeah, running around is so overrated. Thom Yorke dances really well, though, but I'd prefer he stand still, if it meant a longer setlist.
ReplyDeleteHowever, I prefer crowds who stand still as well, so we can all listen to the music in peace. Robert shouldn't demand that people act frenetic all the time; let us all enjoy the music the way you play it, Robert.
moontrip87 your comment is wrong when you said for The Cure "There are no sequenced/pre-recorded guitar parts like in Policy of Truth".
ReplyDeleteThe Cure actually are using pre-recorded guitar parts and have been since the 2000 tour.
Stephen: Sad, but true.
ReplyDeleteWhat guitar parts are pre-recorded? I know I've heard some keys, like in Close to me and Lovesong, but I have not heard any pre-recorded guitar from what I remember. If I am wrong, then I'm sorry.
ReplyDeleteI know they have actually been using sequences since 1997 if you count "wrong number" since Robert's hook up with Reeves Gabrels and he told him about "new technology". There were a lot of loops and such from Bloodflowers, but I am banging my head trying to hear guitar. I was thinking more recent as in the 4tour. I have to go back and listen to some old Dream Tour and Curiosa bootlegs. What a drag Stephen, see what your making me do!!! Having to go back and listen to a bunch of old great shows. hahahaha
ReplyDeleteAhhh, wrong number does have some bits of pre-recorded guitar... Can we just dismiss that one though????
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ReplyDeleteThere are quite a lot of pre-recorded guitar parts, starting from Bloodflowers in 2000 right up to the latest 4:13 Dream album.
ReplyDeleteSome examples going back as far as 2000 would be Maybe Someday, an acoustic guitar plays through the entire song, while Robert and Perry both play electric.
Watching Me Fall had pre-recorded guitar, and back in 2000 I remember people writing show reviews claimed they would watch Robert's fingers in the 39 solo and claimed he could not have possibly been playing what they were actually hearing...
There are lots of other things which are not obvious, the most recent examples I can think of there being pre-recorded guitar are the Rome 4:13 Dream premiere video eg. The Reasons Why and Porl's solo in The Hungry Ghost, and of course more...
In fact it's getting worse, since the latest album has been played live they are using for the first time pre-recorded Robert vocals.
First off! COF is back! THANK YOU CRAIG! HEY GUYS......
ReplyDeleteYeah, Dave loves to shake the goods...but, and if you've seeen the devotional tour dvd, it goes a long way...
Dm and the cure are just two different approaches and fun...I know every song and album by both...its just a different deal...
Can't wait to see them at the h-wood bowl...Getting off the junk goes a long way...if you look at dm's peer who became casualties...like visage...its amazing how powerful Gahan is...
So anywho...big love to all you cof daily checkers like me...mwwaa :)
-Mark B.
i don't think that there are prerecorded tracks in hungru ghost or reasons why, prerecorded voice, yeah in the perfect boy and hungry ghost, but i think he doesn't need it. and i think there is a prerecorded guitar in 39, the guitar at the start. and maybe the guitar in Want could be a prerecorded sequence, but i'm not sure
ReplyDeletewell a practical reason why they dont play 3 hours and have varied setlists - the video projections. it's work to make more for more/different songs
ReplyDeleteWORK?!?! I highly doubt that any of the 'band' members loose much sleep working on the projections.
ReplyDeletebackgrounds and projections are dandy and all but let's not forget the real reason we go to concerts. Just give me a strobe and some colors and I'll be just fine
ReplyDeleteCarlos, like I said, there is pre-recorded guitar in The Reasons Why and The Hungry Ghost...
ReplyDeleteWhy would I make that up ?
Stephen, I'm not saying that you are making it up, I'm just saying that i have not noticed them, and that probably one of us is not listening right, but don't worry it's probably me
ReplyDeleteI think it is a mistake to apply the same standard to both bands.
ReplyDeleteI admire both frontmen.
Robert Smith & Dave Gahan are both incredibly talented. For any of us to have one iota of their artistry (not to mention their ability to remain relevant throughout their 25-30 year careers), we would be tremendously fortunate...
We know how exhausting it is to watch Dave strut his stuff on stage, sway his hips in a seductive manner, stand on en pointe and spin himself around with a mic stand...but I've also seen Robert drenched with sweat on his face & from his hair, hunched over his guitar, thrusting his pelvis into his guitar, ripping away at the strings as if he were ripping out the vessels of his own heart.
Who cares if a concert lasts 2 hours long or 3+ hours long?
We have athletes that are sprinters & we have those that are distance runners. If both achieve a gold metal, does one metal signify greater achievement over the other?
Of course not.
Long live The Cure & Depeche Mode.
Carlos, there is definately pre-recorded guitar in The Reasons Why and The Hungry Ghost.
ReplyDeletekillingtime, well said.
I don't know why people seem to have taken offence at Fletch's comments, I'm sure he totally respects Robert and his comments were in no way supposed to be a put down towards Robert.
The Cure and DM are both great bands...but: i rather go to a the cure concert BECAUSE of the differences in setlists every night ! You dont know what to expect will they play this song or that song??
ReplyDeleteBands like DM have a (almost) standard setlist so when you check the internet before you go to a concert you will know what songs they play. No suprises..
Another big difference between the 2 bands is that Robert dont have to shout "yeah" or whatever to get a reaction from the public...
Just certain parts in songs the people react like in the beginning of a forest or when the bass starts in close to me. When just like heaven is played the whole arena is dancing and Robert just sings and plays his guitar...mmm shame on you ANdy!! I will give you the evil eye at one of the upcoming shows in Rotterdam , Oberhausen and Dusseldorf !! ahhaha
mmmm i hope the cure tours again next year !!
18 songs in NJ? At that rate by the time they get to Vegas on the 22nd they'll be down to a 3 song setlist... WHHHAAAA!!!!
ReplyDeleteI REALLY DO APPRECIATE THE CURE PERFORMANCES!!!! ALWAYS!!!!
I just watched 'prayers for rain' from the paris 2008 gig, and I am absolutely convinced that robert singing his 20 second 'rain' part is prerecorded. There's a reason he's covering his mouth and there's a reason why he's not out of breath at the end of it. And plus there are other significant prerecorded parts, such as the guitar in shake dog shake. W/e it doesn't bother me, it's just a fact that we have to deal with.
ReplyDelete18 songs in AC/NJ and a $150 ticket = $8.33/song.....What a value!!!
ReplyDelete18 songs? That is crappy. It's not our fault they decided to play outside arenas in the middle of the summer. Hello? Why should the fans have to suffer for that. :(
ReplyDeleteHope they don't go any lower on the setlist. I was really digging the setlist for Toronto.
Smooches,
Pussycat
I personally don't find I get much out of Depeche Mode. I used to hear this stuff when I was a kid because of my older brother. So, I bought a few records from the '80s and early '90s and the 2nd Hits album and liked the stuff for a day or 2, but that was it. I'm bored. It's very catchy but there isn't enough depth... for me anyway.
ReplyDeleteWhat guitar parts are pre-recorded during Shake Dog Shake???
ReplyDeleteYeah, I hate the pre-recorded backing vocals. I recently left a band because of so much emphasis on backing tracks. I was always OK with loops and such, but didn't Robert say a while back that they have the approach that if they couldn't play it live, then it wouldn't be played. I stand corrected Stephen, I guess I just didn't want to see it, or hear it rather.
ReplyDeleteJust 18 songs? Heck, The Cure almost has that beat when they do the old school encore! ;-)
ReplyDeletePS: It's almost impossible to have a dm vs cure dispute... While their asthetic is very, very similar: night purples, cold greys,every attitude and emotion made into a color....EXISTS.. and I do love both...I must say that The Cure have the advantage with the 489834938943 songs they can play on a whim.....the surprise us! Love dm.....but hey....our gents have been making original setlists for themselves first....and we benefit second...nevertheless, h-wood bowl shoudld be dm great..! :)
ReplyDeleteps: pardon my grammar....i'm a wino cof contributor...
ReplyDeleteHmm. Some great wine, The Cure, some DM, that's a great evening alright.
ReplyDelete17 songs in atlantic city
ReplyDelete17? Are they trying to take away from NEW ORDER the title for world's shortest sets?
ReplyDelete"Just stands there and sings and plays guitar" is an understatement. Not many sing with as much intensity, emotion or passion as Robert Smith. The way he attacks his guitar on heavier songs can be heard and Felt. He Dances around a bit to the pop songs as well.
ReplyDeleteI love DM, but if Dave could tone it down a little and they could play 30+ songs I'd be much happier. I think he goes over the top, and it's amusing. Don't get me wrong he's a very entertaining front man, just needs to chill out a little. 17 songs is pathetic! Is his Health still an issue? must be...poor guy.
streetcrawler88 - I don't believe that Robert has ever used a backing track for the long note that he holds in "Prayers for Rain".
ReplyDeleteFor instance, I saw them at Red Rocks last year when he had a cold, and he didn't hold the long note at all, or even try to, because his throat was sore. If there was a backing track, why not use it that night?
Also, if you watch different versions of Prayers for Rain, he holds the note for different amounts of times (I have timed some of them to try to figure out the longest one) for instance, 15 seconds is about average but sometimes he draws it out for 17 and sometimes it's as short as 13.
Robert will also vary the note somewhat, and the part at the end where he goes "aiiii-aiii-aaaaaiiin" will start in a different place depending on how long he draws out the note.
Both of these things would be difficult if not impossible to fake with a backing track, for it would be held a consistent time, and the end would not vary as much.
Here's a recording of the song from Red Rocks 2008 (he doesn't do the note at all) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RI6Jwj-HnIE
Warsaw 2008 (about 15 sec.)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TNATIwT2-qU
MSG 2008 (a bit shorter, 13 some sec.) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ncBKqDf-8Bk
A really good one from Coachella where you can see his mouth most of the time he's holding the note (14 sec.)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4G2ZSYXdX-w
you can't really play guitar and sing AND dance at the same time. so it's not robert's fault.
ReplyDeleteand you CAN'T just sing and do NOTHING. you have to move around somehow.
Thanks Rev! I knew the claims about PFR sounded like crap b/c I've seen him try to hold it and just not be able to, and then hold it for shorter times. I think if he was faking it he'd just do a big Entreat one each time, instead of going shorter or sliding into lower notes.
ReplyDeleteAnd, of course, Robert doesn't just stand there, and it's not at all easy for a 50 year-old to play and sing his heart out for three hours.
The Cure has set the bar so high with their shows that just about everything else pales in comparison.
And Gahan doesn't dance around that much. IMHO.
ReplyDeleteThanks Jeff, I absolutely adore it when Robert sings that long note in PFR, and I've paid attention to the different versions of it for years. It was appalling to me that anyone would think there's a backing track there.
ReplyDeleteSome more examples of the variations:
You can sometimes hear his voice crack a little, especially when he holds it longer like here in Nyon, 2002
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XeXimHgkTkI
And of course there's that famous Entreat version (18 sec!)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vALmNS6Z1lc
Sorry, I just re-timed it, that Entreat version goes for almost 23 (22.70) seconds! :D Woo! Go Robert!
ReplyDelete(I start timing when he says "Prayers" because there's no gap where he can get air before the words "for rain")
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ReplyDeleteI was going to comment about how there is no backing track on Robert's voice for Prayers for Rain but Rev has made all the points I was going to make with her analysis.
ReplyDeleteHowever, I will say that the echo effect thats on his voice could give the impression that there is a backing track or at least part of one.
Antii: They played 18 in Atlantic City. Don't go by the setlist posted at DM.com, it's wrong. : ) It left off one song, and originally listed 3 other songs that they cut from the show. At least there is supposed to be a nice surprise added at the NYC shows, which I hope they'll keep for the rest of the tour.
ReplyDeletesurprise ? do tell....
ReplyDeleteLisa: I'm not sure I should say, as I don't want to spoil it for anyone who might not want to know. But at DM.com, there was a post saying Richard Blade said something on his First Wave show about being almost certain that DM would be playing a certain song at one of the NYC shows. It's the title track to one of their classic albums from the mid-80s. It was last played on the Exciter Tour, I think. : )
ReplyDeleteOf course Richard could just be kidding, in which case, I'll kill him for getting my hopes up. : )
let's have a black celebration. ...toooniiiight !!!!!!
ReplyDeleteI'm keeping an eye on the DMMB as they should be playing now.. the setlist should start coming in shortly... apparently the catwalk is back..
I'm so excited- 1 more week for me!!!!
of course I'm just speculating... :P. Didn't get to the Exciter tour... broken leg.
ReplyDeletecraig, richard lied... but then again, maybe tomorrow nite...
ReplyDeleteDave had a malignant tumor removed, please dont put him down for not having the same stamina as the beginning of this year. I love both bands and am see DM tonite. If Robert ever was sick we'd all be happy if he perfromed at all.
ReplyDeleteErm...has Fletch ever looked at the REST of The Cure? Simon's far more active than Dave Gahan. He's up there jumping around the stage, in boots, carrying a heavy bass guitar, for the entire show. Porl dances about in shoes that many people couldn't even walk in. And Robert doesn't just stand still; he certainly gives it his all, and then some.
ReplyDeleteI respect DM, and I enjoy them live, but I wish they'd stop comparing themselves to other bands. What The Cure does or doesn't do with their sets has nothing to do with what DM does.
One surprise, so far, in the set tonight, but not what Richard almost guaranteed. : )
ReplyDeleteOh well, either someone got that info wrong, or Richard Blade is a liar. : ) No classic surprise tonight, but I like that they played 3 songs that they didn't play last night, including one that they've never played before.
ReplyDeleteI saw DM on Monday and my overwhelming feeling as I watched Dave do his thing is that he truly has the audacity of youth...
ReplyDeleteI do wish they played more songs though... they have such a rich catalog of songs that they could have played and they just didn't.
The thing is, I am wondering if perhaps Dave's voice has changed so much that he can no longer hit the notes he could hit 20 years ago - that may be why so many classics are skipped and why he is always holding the mic out to the fans telling us to sing certain parts of the songs.
THEY PLAYED THE TRUTH IS / MILES AWAY!!!!!!!!
ReplyDeleteGod I hope they do that one in Atlanta, GA.
I had a couple friends back out of going to the show in Dallas so I have two extra tickets I am trying to sell!
ReplyDeleteSection 202, Row MM, Seats 28 & 29.
I am selling them both for $150.00 plus shipping. I posted them on eBay if you're interested. If I'm able to ship within Texas shipping cost will be adjusted.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=260460331638&ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT
Can't wait for the show! It is just a few weeks away!
Smooches,
Pussycat